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Armor/AFV: Allied - WWII
Armor and ground forces of the Allied forces during World War II.
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Why aren't there many French tanks in 1/35
Dinocamo
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 12:03 AM UTC
So, I was looking for an ARL-44 kit for a while now, the only result on the 1st page of google relies to it is someone else asking the same question from 2005, so over 10 years ago.

I'm just wondering, why every companies, aside from some European companies, released at least 1 1/35 Tiger I/II kit during the last 10-15 years, but not a single ARL-44 or even an AMX-50? I know there are the AMX-13, the AMX-30 and the Leclerc, and some WW1 and inter Wars tank (Somua S35, the only new kit is from Tamiya in 2015), but these are only a few tanks compare to what the French line up had either eras.

Because French tanks are not iconic, popular and "historical" as other nations? Yes, indeed they are. Though, if one says that "they have no market", it's just an assumption. Does anyone really tried to get on that part of the market in the 1st place? With so many vehicles in 1/35 unproduced.

Lack of information is just an excuse. Saumur tank museum in France is open with many native vehicles and some of them have intact interior. People reached out for Bovington, but not Saumur .

Checking Armorama, I see that people, even if it's sarcastic, are tired of every Tiger and T-34 releases. Yet, many experts are still pointing out the same errors that existed for ages.

Girls und Panzer, like it or not, features French tanks quite recently. I thought it was a marketing opportunity for companies to launch some ww2/early cold war French tank. Yet, still 0 French kit til now. It is just frustrating for me.
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 12:34 AM UTC
There is also the AUF-1 (or whatever the correct designation is) 155mm howitzer on AMX-30 chassis.
There are also a few armoured cars, AMX-10RC, ERC-90 and a few different flavours of Panhard-VBL.
Heller did the VBCI a few years ago and they had the 4x4 and 6x6 VAB.
Tiger Model started off with a few french armoured kits but now they seem to be moving into modern Israeli and Russian and two Leopard-based prototypes.

I think the companies choose to do kits they think will sell, maybe they underestimate the potential market for French armour.

/ Robin
marcb
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 01:40 AM UTC
In 1/35 there are good kits of the UE tractor, S-35, Char B1 bis, Leclerc, AMX-30, etc.

Tiger models has a lot, including wheeled vehicles.
https://www.scalemates.com/brands/tiger-model--4939

ninjrk
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 02:06 AM UTC
As a fan of French tanks, I feel your pain. With that said, things have improved since the days when the only tanks I could buy were those God awful Heller 1/35 kits 30 years ago. Tamiys have given us arguably the best of the WW2 tanks, the Char Bis and Somua S35. They also gave us the LeClerc and Meng tossed us an excellent AMX-30. WW1 French is very well covered. Also we do have a Hotchkiss H39 and Renault R35 in 1/35. We do need a plastic Renault D2 although at least Azimut and Commander's do provide resin kits. I confess to being a bit mystified why these aren't more popular, if people like WW2 panzers for the painting freedom and variety of camouflage patters they should love those French tanks!

Where we have real gaps is in the 1945-1955 range. I want an ARL44 so badly that I literally flew from the US to Saumur so I could climb over theirs and measure it for scratchbuilding. I suspect part of the problem is that they were in service fairly briefly, never went into combat, and were objectively failures. Which as a fan is no reason not to do those (and give me an AMX M4 while you're at it!) but I guess does explain it a bit.

With that said, God bless World of Tanks for making these types of tanks popular and potentially marketable. I would not be entirely surprised to see an ARL44, AMX-50, and British A43 Black Prince in the next 1-3 years simply because many manufacturers seem willing to tackle some pretty rare subjects for us. Time will tell!
Frenchy
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 02:11 AM UTC

Quoted Text

So, I was looking for an ARL-44 kit for a while now, the only result on the 1st page of google relies to it is someone else asking the same question from 2005, so over 10 years ago.



If you're not on a budget, you can find a 3D-printed one on Shapeways....

https://www.shapeways.com/product/G3VGRKM58/pv192f-arl-44-heavy-tank-1-35

Blitz Kit has released some late 30's French tanks in resin.

http://blitz-kit.fr/21-vehicule

H.P.
marcb
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 03:47 AM UTC
Also, Hobbybos makes the Schneider and St Chamond, and Takom the St Chamond, so there's actualy a lot out there.

Both Blast models and KMT make resin figures and upgrades for French vehicles.

My only wish is a good VAB 4x4 for the early/ mid 1990's...

Blast
https://www.blast-models.eu/en/

KMT
http://www.phpshopxml.com/135models.shop/CID/d9b8abedabb170532ab1ad7d303862f0/function/catalogPageDisplay/shopLanguage/ENG/shopCurrency/EURO


Regards,

Marc
Dinocamo
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 04:04 AM UTC

Quoted Text

There is also the AUF-1 (or whatever the correct designation is) 155mm howitzer on AMX-30 chassis.
There are also a few armoured cars, AMX-10RC, ERC-90 and a few different flavours of Panhard-VBL.
/ Robin



I saw these AMX-30 kits stay the in stock of a local store for years, including the SPAA version. I tend to focus on tanks more than just any AFV.

Takom has a wide range of AMX-13, which is nice. Still, as Mr Matt Flegal said, and I insist to extend the period, the time frame from 1940 to 1955 is really lacking. The WW1 is "well covered" because they are relatively small and easy to take a staple. Also, it feels like once someone make a kit of a French vehicle then it is considered covered, which is pale in comparison to the British WW1 which get so much more attention. Meng FT-17 is on my list, but it is a tiny tank...

I also visited Saumur in 2017 and I really admire ARL-44 and AMX-50. They are not considered successful, but even the US prototype T29/30/34 and T28/95 are all considered failure but they get covered thanks to World of Tanks. The French tanks are really underappreciated.

War Thunder from Gaijin, a competitor to World of Tanks, had send a team to Saumur to take measures of the French tanks to make the model for their game. People are also known to contact the Museum for information.

Thanks Henri-Pierre for the suggestion. However, I prefer plastic kits as they are easier to work with for me.

P/s: I apologise for the rant.
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 04:16 AM UTC
Char 2C maybe? It was in "service" in 1940 ...


When I mentioned AMX-30 and the AUF I was thinking about the kits from Meng, I don't think Meng has done the SPAA version yet.




























During the period 1940 - 1955 there wasn't all that many tanks Made in France.
http://www.chars-francais.net/2015/index.php/liste-chronologique/de-1945-a-1990
I would like to have kits of the ARL and the AMX-50 too ...

Edit: I forgot about this one ...

KurtLaughlin
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 05:14 AM UTC
To answer your question, I suggest you search any modeling forum or magazine for the phrase "Why don't they make". You will find the subject discussed hundreds of times.

The answer ultimately comes down to money, like everything else in the world.

KL
bill_c
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MODEL SHIPWRIGHTS
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 07:09 AM UTC
We see something similar over on Large Scale Planes: WNW has released some weird-assed planes I've never heard of, but a state-of-the-art Spad? Thankfully Copper State Models has released two versions of the iconic Nieuport 17.

The parade of box art above shows there has been an upsurge in French AFVs, especially post-war. Maybe the humiliation of 1940 makes pre-WW2 and early WW2 vehicles commercial pariahs?
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 07:25 AM UTC

Quoted Text

.....

Maybe the humiliation of 1940 makes pre-WW2 and early WW2 vehicles commercial pariahs?













Not counting the kits made by Heller
marcb
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 07:58 AM UTC
This is also an example of people not first doing a Google search to answer their own question. Googling "1/35 french tanks", shows all these tanks...

Don't ask people to do your work for you. We're all glad to help, but please make an effort yourself first.

Regards,

Marc
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 08:51 AM UTC
Oh well,
gives me something to do when I am bored
panzerbob01
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 09:00 AM UTC
Just for the amusement and a little bit of curiosity needing assuaging... I just did a quick Google around 1/35 French (armor, military, tank) kits and a little variation on those Q's.

I found over 120 1/35 kits covering about 30 general subjects from WWI, WWII period, and post-WWII. "General subjects" meaning a general model or type of vehicle, such as "AMX-13". There are quite a few variants on the AMX-13 chassis, as there are on the Lorraine 37/38L types, Renault R-35, etc. Many of the WWII-era tanks appear in both French original and German re-used / mod versions. My search only included tracked and wheeled armored vehicles - no moto's, no trucks and cars, figure sets, etc.

We should note when speaking of the French that many of the pre-WWII vehicles were adapted and modified by the Germans, and that the 1945 - 1955 period saw modest French vehicle production - and post-WWII French forces used a lot of ex-US, Brit, German vehicles in the first few years after WWII. My search excluded all of those seconded foreign things.

There's a pretty nice and currently expanding range of French stuff to build and modify. And yes, just like with all the other nation's military-in-models, there are gaps and seemingly common French vehicles not yet kitted. I think... Just Wait! They'll eventually appear.

One of the more interesting observations from my little search is that there is all of about one French plastic model company (Heller), and no current French manufacturing of "modern, state-of-art" French military kits.

Cheers! Bob
nikon1
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 09:19 AM UTC
Y'all have more selections of French equipment in 1/35 plastic than we do in Braille Scale. We only have a very small handful of options in Braille Scale. I know of the Leclerc from RoG, the 4x4 VAB by Heller Char Bis from Trumpeter and R-35 from S Model. Ace is set to release the Panhard VBL. Count your blessings
Cheers
Charle
grunt136mike
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 12:39 PM UTC
Hi;

GGEEEEZZZZZ; WHY AREN'T THERE ANY 1/35 RUSSIAN (SOVIET) ARMOR !!!!!!!!!!

CHEERS; MIKE.
Graywolfgang
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 03:43 PM UTC
Never fired, but only dropped (abandoned) once
dtniedert
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 05:19 PM UTC
I would like to see an AMX VCI or a AMX 10P
Removed by original poster on 01/15/19 - 08:22:31 (GMT).
Frenchy
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Posted: Monday, January 14, 2019 - 08:30 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I know of the Leclerc from RoG, the 4x4 VAB by Heller Char Bis from Trumpeter and R-35 from S Model.



You can add the AMX 30/105, AMX 13/105 and the Somua S-35 from Heller.

https://www.heller.fr/fr/29-maquettes-vehicules-militaires-classique?orderby=price&orderway=asc&orderway=asc

RPM has released some French WW2 armor as well :

Some examples

H.P.
panzerbob01
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Posted: Tuesday, January 15, 2019 - 03:46 AM UTC
Dinocamo identified a seeming lack of 1/35 scale kits of French tanks...

It should be clear to all that there actually are a fairly rich diversity of French armor kits in 1/35th scale.... covering AT LEAST 30 FRENCH-BUILT types of tanks, armored-cars, and APC distributed over the WWI, WWII, and post-war-to-modern eras.

Many available kits reflect these originally-French vehicles in modified versions such as those used by the Germans in WWII.

When we add in 1/35 kits of French military-use cars and trucks, and start to include foreign-made vehicles adopted and used by the French at various times, the type-range and kit-number blossom. (Hey! German fans surely appreciate this sort of useful "expansion" and "inclusivity", given the number of foreign-made vehicles the Germans used in WWII - and the richness in kits depicting these acquisitions!)

While "rich", all can also see that the current list of original French types represented by 1/35 scale kits is LIMITED.... As are the lists of types rep'd by kits for about any country!

Now should come our usual "wish-lists" for French stuff that isn't well-represented yet. From where I sit, we have some good selections of R-35, S-35, H-37/38/39, Char B1, FT, St. Chamond, Schneider, AMX-13, AMX-30, LeClerk, VAB, AML, AMD, EBR, and Lorraine types available, among others. What are we really lacking? What types are not yet reasonably represented by 1/35th scale kits???

My "votes" for "more French armor in 1/35th" include: FCM tanks, Renault D, AMC and AMR types, Panhard and Laffly armored-cars and tractors, and Citroen-Kegresse half-tracks, for starters!

Maybe if enough folks clamor for "MORE French!", some kit-makers will eventually rise to the occasion and opportunity!

Bob
firstcircle
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Posted: Tuesday, January 15, 2019 - 10:04 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Y'all have more selections of French equipment in 1/35 plastic than we do in Braille Scale. We only have a very small handful of options in Braille Scale. I know of the Leclerc from RoG, the 4x4 VAB by Heller Char Bis from Trumpeter and R-35 from S Model. Ace is set to release the Panhard VBL. Count your blessings
Cheers
Charle


There's Model Miniature
They even have a section called "French Section".
TerancekW
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Posted: Tuesday, January 15, 2019 - 12:36 PM UTC
I would like to see AMR, esp AMR ZB
panzerbob01
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Posted: Tuesday, January 15, 2019 - 01:05 PM UTC
Amusement 101!

Right NOW, looking on the evilbay "newly listed" armor kits... There are 7 1/35 French vehicle kits, and 1 track set, out of the MOST RECENT 100 listings posted TODAY!

Maybe folks are watching this thread and making some sort of "statement"???

Bob
grunt136mike
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Posted: Tuesday, January 15, 2019 - 01:47 PM UTC
Hi;

It Seems to Me that Some people can't comprehend the Question in the First place, and others know little about the Hobby in general, or even How to use A Search feature in the first place !!!!!!!!! |: Now I will Confess that I am not A Rocket Expert; But It never fails to Amaze me the answer's that some people post !
CHEERS; MIKE.