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Campaigns: Ardennes Offensive
This is the campaign group for Ardennes Offensive
Hosted by Richard S.
Ardennes Offensive MP-40 Finished...
woltersk
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Utah, United States
Member Since: May 27, 2003
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Posted: Tuesday, April 19, 2005 - 11:15 AM UTC
...I think.
I'm calling it done.

Completed the magazine, added some dried mud to the the stock and cracks & crevaces, weathered & attached the sling.

What do ya think?



Magazine Detail:


Stock Detail:


Stock Folded:


HeavyArty
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Florida, United States
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Posted: Tuesday, April 19, 2005 - 11:26 AM UTC
Yes, it looks like an MP-40, but what does a 1:1 scale MP-40 replica have to do with the Ardennes Campaign? MP-40s were used in all theatres throughout the war. Still don't see the connection.
Grumpyoldman
Staff MemberConsigliere
KITMAKER NETWORK
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Posted: Tuesday, April 19, 2005 - 11:27 AM UTC
Sure looks real to me....
Nice job....... Glad you finished it in time also.
Martinnnn
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Zuid-Holland, Netherlands
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Posted: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 - 02:30 AM UTC
Your MP-40 looks really good but I have to agree with Gino: What is the connection with the Ardennes Offensive??

Why not make a 1:1 scale German to carry the MP-40?

:-)

Martin
woltersk
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Posted: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 - 12:49 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Yes, it looks like an MP-40, but what does a 1:1 scale MP-40 replica have to do with the Ardennes Campaign? MP-40s were used in all theatres throughout the war. Still don't see the connection.



Gino and Martin,
I understand where you’re coming from. Let me tell you how this all transpired.

Before I entered this kit I PM’d Shonen Red to ask if it would be alright.

I told him—“If you feel this is too far out of this campaign's realm don't worry about letting me know--I still have my 1/9th Feldgendarme figure in work!”

Shonen replied—“Whoa! That'll be a unique entry for the campaign. I'm gonna like it. But please do post inprog shots of you work so that others may see it as a "model" and it has to be assembled like any other kit.”

After the first time this issue came up I thought long and hard about how to give it an ‘Ardennes’ angle. My conclusion was this—is it necessary for an entry to have a connection, other than having been used there, to a Campaign? I understand vehicle and aircraft unit markings should match those that participated. Figures should have the appropriate uniforms and gear for the campaign. Gino, you said it yourself MP-40s were used in all theatres throughout the war, so what is so wrong about having a dirty, rusty, submachine gun, in this Campaign? Would it make that much of a difference if I had white washed it? Laid it in a snow bank and sprinkled some blood around it? Placed camo white material over the bulk of it? It is not like I entered a submarine or the Starship Enterprise.

The Campaign rules state:
- Our task is to recreate or to build any kit that participated in the Ardennes Offensive whether Allied or Axis.
- Build any figure, vehicle or aircraft that participated in the Battle of the Bulge.

The MP-40 did participate.

It has been stated over and over on Armorama that we are here to have fun. I participate in Campaigns for the camaraderie, for the added incentive to work on kits, and for the shear enjoyment of it. Is it so wrong to enter this kit in this campaign? I am not in it for the ribbon. I have enough real ones from the Air Force. I am not making any money being in a Campaign. Not winning any contest. I’m just here for the fun of it.

If you can convince me it is unfair and whom it is harming, I’ll gladly bow out.



rbeebe99
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Member Since: August 13, 2004
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Posted: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 - 01:00 PM UTC
Keith,
I think you did a bang up job on it, so much in fact I ordered one from Shorty's air soft for $12, I hope mine comes out half as good as yours. As for you entering it, I see no problem with it. The MP-40 was there, I am pretty sure that other weapon systems in Ardennes participated in other theaters also, Sherman, King TIger, Panther that should not exclude someone from entering those. Maybe you are modleing Peipers MP-40. I am not trying to start an argument with anyone, and I respect everyone's opinion, I just don't see the harm in it.
Regards,
Robert
jimbrae
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Provincia de Lugo, Spain / España
Member Since: April 23, 2003
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Posted: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 - 11:20 PM UTC
First of all, it's an impressive piece of work - superbly done.

Secondly, I do have to agree with Gino (Heavy Arty) about what this has to do with a campaign. I'm frankly puzzled.

This doesn't take away from your work at all...Jim
JPTRR
Staff MemberManaging Editor
RAILROAD MODELING
#051
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Tennessee, United States
Member Since: December 21, 2002
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Posted: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 - 11:40 PM UTC
Tell me about the kit? Plastic, resin, metal? Who makes it, who sells it?
TUNA
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Massachusetts, United States
Member Since: March 16, 2003
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Posted: Thursday, April 21, 2005 - 01:00 AM UTC
I agree with Keith... Sherman's were used in a lot of campaign's of the war... no one would be given a hard time for submitting one, or a Sdkfz 251... and many other models...

Someone might say, but the markings mean it's particular to that campaign, but a lot of modelers, model for fun, and don't get to that level of detail with markings and such, and I'm sure the majority of them would not be turned down.. I remember in Incoming a lot of people were allowed to enter direct fire Anti Tank guns!

I think Keith's piece is a Fine entry to the campaign!..

great work Keith!

HeavyArty
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Florida, United States
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Posted: Thursday, April 21, 2005 - 03:01 AM UTC
Still don't see the connection to the Ardennes Offensive campaign. Whether the Campaign moderator said it is O.K. or not. In my opinion, the piece, wheather tank, figure, weapons system, etc, should have some way to identify that it is in the Ardennes to be in the campaign. A lone MP-40 doesn't have that. Why not paint up a canteen then, they were there too, or a M1 helmet, there too. I also don't see how a plastic BB gun that you put together and painted is a model, but that is another argument.

I could really care less about if it is in the cmpaign or not, just don't see the reasoning. Kinda why I don't really do the campaigns. They end up being too broad and anything can be part of it.


Quoted Text

I remember in Incoming a lot of people were allowed to enter direct fire Anti Tank guns!



My point exactly. Direct fire AT Guns are not Artillery, which was the original design of the campaign. Then you get all sorts of people saying, what about this or that piece. I'm sure it was used as artillery at X battle in Y campaign, I read it in so and so's excellent Sherman book that I aid $250 for, etc., etc, etc.

Why not just build your models and be happy with them, why do you need a "Campaign Ribbon" here to feel good?

Enough rambling. I just don't get it.
Davester444
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England - West Midlands, United Kingdom
Member Since: March 09, 2005
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Posted: Thursday, April 21, 2005 - 03:29 AM UTC
I think it is just a matter of opinion on whether you think this should be accepted for the campaign. I understand both sides, but I think if the campaign leader says that its acceptable then we should agree with him/her.
woltersk
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Utah, United States
Member Since: May 27, 2003
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Posted: Thursday, April 21, 2005 - 11:15 AM UTC
Dave, Charlie, Jim, Rbeebe99, Martin--Thanks for the kind words and encouragement. It was a fun and different build. Sorry about the controversy. That definitely was not my goal. But hey, anything that gets people thinking and talking can't be all bad, right?

Fred--The ‘kit’ is actually an airsoft ‘bb’ gun. All plastic.


Made by a Chinese company called Cyma.
Go here, scroll down. It was only $19 US brand new.

http://www.airsoftatlanta.com/rifle.htm

Be warned: the kit is really cheap, as in it is not too strong. It is all plastic except for the hardware holding it together and the guts for the firing mechanism. I reinforced the hollow folding stock arms with the only thing I found that would fit--lengths of cable TV coax!

I also added some ballast, 'D' cell batteries and nuts & bolts, to the inside to get it close to the real weight of ~8 lbs.


rfeehan
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Kansas, United States
Member Since: July 20, 2003
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2005 - 01:55 AM UTC
If you added batteries to this I hope you have a way to replace those batteries with something else. Even unused batteries will eventually leak acid. I had a box of spares in the garage that were less than 2 years old and last weekend I found that 4 D cells were leaking and they were a good brand name battery.

Nice work I have fired the real thing (years ago a friend was a collector and one of the few Canadians licensed to collect full auto weapons) and yours looks very real.